DG takes over LS Flugzeugbau
DG Flugzeugbau (Bruchsal, Germany) and LS Flugzeugbau (Egelsbach, Germany) are joining their forces under the leadership of DG Flugzeugbau in response to the continuous economic difficulties for the civil aviation industryThis will not affect the existing base of approximately 3.000 LS customers worldwide. They will continue receiving original spare parts and high quality service out of the DG factory in Bruchsal.
The production of LS airplanes will continue, in particular the LS8 in all current variants. Also, flight testing and certification of the new LS10 will continue.
The facility in Egelsbach will be closed and its operations relocated. Some important LS employees will join the team of DG Flugzeugbau to continue the care of the LS product family and to stay in close contact with its customer base.
This cooperation will protect the investment of current LS aircraft owners, since further production and development remains in the competent hands of a leading German aircraft manufacturer.
This is pretty closely the text of a press announcement as we circulate it in summer 2003.
So, what does this mean?
First, it is very sad that a renowned glider manufacturer will cease to exist soon.
Rolladen-Schneider has had to go into receivership, and DG Flugzeugbau did not take over the liabilities but only the rights to build the gliders and use the brand name.
It is however relieving, that the LS brand will continue, together with the know-how it represents. Key LS employees will be available to us, even so the production is currently halted.
Soon the LS8 will be available again as an “LS8-s” (and not as “DG-700” or similar). We will continue the 15m version as well as the 15/18m version and the Turbo with the newly developed engine actuation. Delivery is possible from summer 2004; the list price will remain unchanged in the moment. However the finish quality will become remarkably better, this much can we promise right now.
The LS10 did undergo an extensive test and evaluation program. Based on the results we decided to build this interesting new glider. But the main decision factor is the demand, and that means you, our customers.
Regarding spare parts and service, we hope that LS customers will become DG customers soon. Our team ensures with its know-how the continuation of high quality service.
Of course, the new organization has already started, and we mastered the complex move from Egelsbach to Bruchsal.
It is very important for us get the e-mail addresses of all existing LS owners. This enables us to rapidly provide LS owners with all upcoming information regarding their gliders. If you are not yet registered for our newsletter, please do so.
e-Mail Address
With best whishes from the DG Team
for a good relationship
-friedel weber - July 2003
Translation: Manfred Koethe
........and where do we go from here?
During the summer holidays and the World Championships in Leszno / Poland I had the opportunity to talk to a lot of pilots and experts about the takeover of LS. One of the main concerns seemed to be that the LS brand should be kept alive and developed further – and this is exactly what we at DG want to do.
A few words about brand philosophy
No, the brands DG and LS are not exchangeable. Ok, the respective gliders in the same classes have the same colour, wingspan and a similar performance, but they are most certainly not the same. Neither are the respective customers.
Picture the difference between a "typical LS customer" and a "typical DG customer". I’m sure you can immediately think of several differences. I can also think of numerous typical descriptions, but if we discussed our connotations we would not get to the same assessments.
Why is that? Take an example from the car industry and try to convince a Mercedes E series lover to buy a 5 series BMW – or vice versa. Well, enjoy... even though both cars have four wheels and are of similar dimensions and power you’ll still find this a difficult task. Listening to the heated arguments about car brands can be quite amusing.
You get exactly the same with glider pilots. Let’s assume that the DG and the LS pilots can be grouped in two circles that overlap slightly. You’ve got the "LS fans" who would never buy or fly a DG glider, and you’ve also got the DG fans who would never set foot in an LS glider. And then you have the overlap with people who quite like both DG and LS gliders.
But we should by no means assume that only because DG have "integrated" LS, the LS fans will in the future like DG gliders – on the contrary!
So we won’t absorb the LS brand into DG,
but instead we’ll keep and develop LS as an independent product.
You might also want to bear in mind that only DG Flugzeugbau is actually capable of giving the LS brand a future. This is without doubt the main and obvious advantage: Only a well-known manufacturer of high-performance gliders with a good and stable financial background can take over such a big brand and maintain it properly. In the standard class Schleicher and Schempp-Hirth are provided for in the shape of the ASW 28 and Discus 2, but our DG-303 is showing its age, and the DG-700 never got beyond the planning stage. I guess we can now safely skip the number 700.
So you see that DG Flugzeugbau is destined to continue the tradition of the LS brand.
Right, so much for the brand philosophy.
To make sure that all the LS and DG competition pilots are even better catered for in the future we managed to get the well-known pilot Holger Back on board, who will join our team on a freelance basis.
Spare parts
The warehouse has moved. The items are logged in the computer system. Sold-out items have been ordered and are available now. LS had manufactured all fittings themselves – this will not be continued, instead we’ll use specialized companies.
Delivery times of max. 24 hours, normal for DG customers, have already been achieved for the LS spare parts, too.
This all will mean a significant improvement for LS customers in comparison to the previous system.
Technical Notes
These - plus all the manuals - are available on the internet. Günter Schapka from LS Flugzeugbau had kept the huge number of files in a good order so they could be published without any modification.
Service
Of course our LS customers from now on will enjoy the same quality standards regarding customer service and related work that DG customers are used to. So you'll receive service from the manufacturer directly - with direct access to all documents - even older ones. Please contact us for an appointment.
For technical questions about your glider send a mail to the following address:
service-ls(at)dg-flugzeugbau.de
Warranty
Now here’s some slightly less positive news:
The company Rolladen-Schneider, before going into receivership, delivered and received payment for gliders in the last two years that might have had the odd defect. Any defects can be fixed by DG Flugzeugbau - but unfortunately not for free. Please bear in mind that we never received any payment for these gliders so we could never provide for any warranty payments. These gliders and payments just "passed us by", so to speak.
For new gliders however where a deposit has been paid things are different:
For those gliders we’ve included a clause in the contract that ensures that any deposit payments will be honoured by DG. But unfortunately by an action of another so called "Investors Group" this clause has been cancelled later by the insolvency lawyer. Now it is not predictable what will happen with our clause and the deposits.
The various glider types
LS1
The spare parts provision is completely secured within the last months. Several gliders are approaching their 3000 or 6000 hour limit, in which case we are offering to do the relevant checks to extend their lifetimes.
LS2
Only one glider, which will continue to be looked after by Wolf Lemke himself.
LS3
Same applies as to the LS1.
Incidentally, my club bought an LS3 in need of some TLC about 4 years ago for a comparatively small sum of money. They had it re-gelled and now it looks as new. As a manufacturer I am obviously in two minds about this as it becomes apparent that you can use those gliders almost "indefinitely". How are we supposed to sell any new gliders? On the other hand this impressive lifetime justifies the high prices of new gliders which then can be flown over decades with very little, if any, loss of value.
For my part I definitely enjoy flying our LS3 locally!
LS4
People who know the LS4 know why this glider became so popular. It is probably the ideal glider for inexperienced pilots – due to its 100% foolproof undercarriage mechanism, the big cockpit and the very docile flying characteristics.
But even so only 12 gliders were made in the two years before the insolvency, as the LS8 just totally outshines the LS4 with regards to performance. So this means that we can’t continue making the LS4.
There was a strong interest of another group of investors around AMS in Slovenia, to continue building this glider for club use. But at its end this was not successful.
At any case: Support service and spare part deliveries will be done by DG Flugzeugbau, the T/C holder!
AMS will deliver some necessary spare parts for LS4 and LS6 only. That means rudder, ailerons, horizontal stabilizers - everything what might be damaged. LS4 owner can order these parts from AMS, Slovenia directly. Please have in mind that AMS is an independent company so we are not able to guarantee any time of delivery or similar things.
This at any case will be good news for all LS4 owners!
LS5
Another single glider that's being taken care of by Wolf Lemke
LS6
This glider, as you probably know, was supposed to be replaced by the LS10. We won't carry on building this glider. We will however still support the pilots and deliver all metal spare parts and a couple of GFK spare parts.
LS7
A similar situation applies to this glider. After all, the obvious successor of the LS7 is the LS8.
LS8
This was and still is the flagship of the LS fleet and will be continued in all variants.
Start of production already happened. Deliveries can be made in summer 2004.
Plus, as mentioned before, the finish quality will be improved significantly without impacting the price.
LS9
Only 10 gliders of this type were built and they are still to be certified. Of course we won't leave these customers in the lurch but will think of a solution to carry out the remaining work.
LS10
Well, yes, of course this has always been the most pressing subject!
First of all a word about the cost: To get this glider ready for serial production would still cost a lot of money - an estimated cost of €500,000 for all tests, construction of all production moulds and the certification work is probably realistic.
First of all the glider is tested thoroughly to find out about all its performance details.
Several well-known pilots have already carried out test flights during our summer holidays 2003 - including some flights in direct comparison with various competitors' gliders. The results are all very positive. You also need to consider that the prototype is totally "raw". What that means is that no fine tuning whatsoever has been done yet. For example experience shows that the correct placing of the turbulator tape can increase the performance significantly.
All pilots have praised the nice flying characteristics, typical for LS gliders, and all in all the glider is also rather pretty.
The second criterion that we'll bring this glider into production is the brand philosophy I mentioned earlier. We are very aware that the further development of the LS10 will be seen as an important touchstone as to whether we are serious about brand care.
And finally the third criterion concerns you - our customers:
The more interest we see with regards to this glider, the more definite orders we receive, the easier the decision will be to take this glider all the way to serial production. If you are interested in buying an LS10 please do let us know.
So you see what my thoughts are regarding the LS10...
There is still a lot to do.
I'd like to ask the LS customers amongst our readers to give us, DG-Flugzeugbau, your trust and confidence.
Please give us the chance to show you that with DG-Flugzeugbau you are in even better hands than you were with LS.
- friedel weber -
Translation: Claudia Buengen
DG and LS "join forces"
Article in Sailplane&Gliding Aug/Sept-2003
As S&G went to press in early July, two leading German glider manufacturers, DG and LS, were due to announce that they were: "joining their forces under the leadership of DG Flugzeugbau, in response to the continuous economic difficulties for the civil aviation industry".
Karl-Heinz Schneider, of LS Flugzeugbau, was not prepared to comment to S&G before the official announcement. But Friedel Weber of DG Flugzeugbau, knowing that this issue of S&C would appear after the announcement, confirmed that the agreement will have taken effect by the time you read this. He said the deal was made because of the after-effects of the terrorist attacks on the USA in 2001.
"September 11 was the significant day. The situation is very bad," explained Friedel Weber, He added it was an opportunity to expand DG's business without using new people. LS's Egelsbach factory will close, he said, but four or five of LS's 60-plus people - including Karl-Heinz Schneider - eventually will work from the current DG factory at Bruchsal. This will become the base for supporting LS`s 3,000 or so customers, using original LS parts. "This co-operation will protect the investment of current LS aircraft owners," said the draft announcement, "since further production and development remains in the competent hands of a leading German aircraft manufacturer". DG will, it added, honor all existing down payments and options on new LS gliders. Asked how much DG had paid, Friedel Weber would not be drawn. "A reasonable price," he replied.
LS, manufacturer of the popular LS4 and LS8 gliders, has recently been developing the turbo LS8 (see also p38), the LS9 and the LS10, as well as working with the Akaflieg Koeln on a two-seater, the LS11.
All variants of the LS8 - LS8A, LS8B, LS8T, and the LS8-15/18 - will continue in production, said DG, with delivery times next spring, but the future of LS4 production has yet to be decided. The LS11 will not be developed for production by DG. The LS10 had its maiden flight on June 6 this year. Development to certification will continue, pending comparison flights with the DG-808S, says Friedel Weber. (See the June-July S&G, pp28-30, for more details of the LS10 and DG-808s). To move the LS10 to series production, wing destruction and flutter tests are needed. Certification of the LS9, of which 10 have been sold, will continue, but no new orders will be taken.
DG, established by Friedel Weber and Gerhard Wolff after Glaser-Dirks went bankrupt, plans to continue all its existing range. LS owners need to subscribe to DG's emailed newsletter to make sure they receive technical notes as DG does not post these out (email the subject line "newsletters, please" to
weber(at)dg-flugzeugbau.de).
Moulds from Rolladen-Schneider in our final assembly hall until March 2004
As you can see: there was no production going on here yet!
The production of LS gliders is about to begin!
Even though I thought I’d made it reasonably clear there still seem to be quite a few pilots who don’t want to believe that the row over Rolladen-Schneider is really over, and that DG Flugzeugbau is now responsible for the production of the LS8 as well as the further development of the LS10. Let me therefore reassure you that production preparations are in full flow in Bruchsal, that we've managed to hire a number of former LS employees, and that the first LS gliders should be finished as early as Summer 2004.
Unfortunately we noticed that the moulds are in an appalling state. Probably due to lack of funds, for years Rolladen-Schneider seems to have invested nothing whatsoever in the moulds, did none of the necessary repairs and didn’t rectify any known issues. Some of these are rather serious and can only be rectified with a lot of effort. This is what we are doing at the moment, and until the moulds are in a condition that the gliders made in them comply with our quality standards, we won’t be starting production.
But this should really be the last delay now and production is almost imminent.
- friedel weber - april 2004 -
Translation: Claudia Buengen
The first fuselage "Made by DG" ready for rough assembly - May, 5th, 2004
Swen Lehner wrote:
"Hereby I send you one picture of our first LS8 fuselage, which came out of the molds Mai 5th. It was built by our LS8-Team (Helge Kennel und Waldemar Erich) with support of DG (Willi Kramer).
Unfortunately we forgot to put a daily newspaper into the scenery to proof the date of the picture..."
The first LS8 wing - built in Bruchsal
....and then I received the following mail:
Hi Friedel,
what's happening about the turbo for the LS8? In particular I'd like to know when DG will come up with definite prices and schedules.
I have to admit that I'm beginning to be a tad nervous. I'm not suggesting that DG behaves in the same way that LS did, but I would really like to see some facts.
This nervousness is probably due to the history of our customer relation with LS: We gave our glider to Rolladen-Schneider, free of charge, for flight tests during the certification of the LS8b. Partly because of that we didn't get the glider fitted with an engine before delivery. Karl-Heinz however promised us to retrofit a certified turbo engine during Winter 2003/04. Well, unfortunately we still only have an LS8b that was repainted in some places after the flight tests, but doesn't have an engine.
Reply:
Right, please let me say it again:
The takeover of a complete company doesn't happen over night. In particular the moulds needed considerable reworking as they were in an incredibly bad condition. It is almost impossible to believe how anyone could have built good gliders with them!
Helge Kennel – the colleague on the above photo – called this: "Making of Prototypes up to works number 475!"
We refurbished all the moulds and added lots of fittings which are essential for ensuring consistent accuracy while using the moulds in serial production. And above all they enable us to deliver the required build quality.
With regards to production using the big moulds everything is now working seamlessly. The first gliders have passed assembly and finish, so the learning curve in those sectors is flattening out a bit. Currently – Sept. 2004 – the first two gliders are at final assembly stage and will be delivered shortly.
You might also like to know that we've recently made a few good test flights to compare the glider with that of one particular competitor. The performance potential of the LS8 is quite incredible. The numerous first places in various competitions this summer (in particular the European Championships in Lithuania) are quite a clear indicator as well.
To sum up:
We are not Rolladen-Schneider,
but we build their excellent products
(and we're reliable!)
Translation: Claudia Buengen
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A short time ago Martyn Wells, our representative in UK came to Bruchsal to pick up the second LS8 built by DG Flugzeugbau. He is LS representative for decades and knows all LS gliders very well. He slowly touched the surface of our LS8 and said:
"Well I never saw such a nice LS8 in my life!"
I think that at the beginning of this article and 1 1/2 years ago I exactly had promised to build in such a quality!
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Certification Process of the new LS8-st is done!
At Aug.19th, 2005 - during our holidays - from the EASA (Europeen Aircraft Safety Agency) we received the final Certification Document of the LS8-s and LS8-st. Here you can have a look on it:
And so, this article of the process of taking over the Rolladen-Schneider Company and its brand will end. Many people did not believe on it, but in the meantime DG Flugzeugbau has become a new good and safe home for the brand
"LS"
Other Articles of Interest: | |
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| LS8: The first "Turbos" from Bruchsal - Report of G. Marzinzik |
| LS8-st: 15/18 Meter Standard-Turbo made by DG |